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Old 04-26-2012, 12:07 PM   #241
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Originally Posted by Dummie View Post
Maybe true, but that's not what will be on the ballot. The measure will prevent non-indian gillnetting and allow seines. The only thing affecting sports is to maintain the current allocation. Sorry if reality is uncomfortable.
Seems to me all they want is more fish. They gotta make it look good by adding allow use of seines. But seines won't work! Seines will fail and we will be right back with gillnets.the spring Chinook never recovered when we didn't fish on them for the 5 Years in the past.

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Old 04-26-2012, 12:15 PM   #242
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

If seines don't work (but they will) there are many other options before gill nets. How about they open hook-and-line commercial fishing? Allow anyone who wishes to purchase a commercial license and fish rod and reel. If removing hatchery fish is the mission let everyone participate. The impacts on wild fish would be greatly reduced.
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Old 04-26-2012, 12:19 PM   #243
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Oh, you mean like limiting our sturgeon catch to only 5 fish a year?

How many sturgeon are the nets allowed every day they are out? Every year? I guess those don't count as they are incidental catch?

And who tells the Sea Lions how many they get? And enforces it?


Of the three groups, sports are far more selective than the others.
If the sportys are so worried about saving fish why do they need to have a year round catch and release fishery on sturgeon? What good comes out of this to a fish? And why not single barbless hook on spring salmon? Barbed treble hooks can't be good on a wild fish you let go after digging out of its gills!
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Old 04-26-2012, 01:05 PM   #244
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Originally Posted by crabbait View Post
If seines don't work (but they will) there are many other options before gill nets. How about they open hook-and-line commercial fishing? Allow anyone who wishes to purchase a commercial license and fish rod and reel. If removing hatchery fish is the mission let everyone participate. The impacts on wild fish would be greatly reduced.
Of course seines will work. They killed every thing in the river. Right?? Thats why they outlawed them! At least that is what Joe said in an earlier post.(i know they dont kill every thing) I agree with crabbait- i really like the idea of open hook and line commercial fishery. That way we all can have a good chance of nailing a springer, and the average fisher man may be able to make some cash as well. Even the netters can take advantage of that. I do not think they could really make as much as they normally would, but it would let us all continue to fish. It would be nice to not have to release a fish you could be paid for! Just think.... being paid to pike minnow fish, and king salmon at the same time!!!! That would be SICK!!(in a good way) crabbait- do you think the impacts on esa fish will drop to almost 0 if open hook& line was implemented?
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Old 04-26-2012, 01:45 PM   #245
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

I'm not a biologist but I think hook/line commercial fishing could be done with very small impacts. Using multiple fairly heavy rods so that you could bring the fish to hand quickly, typical braided line, single barbless hooks for quick release, I suspect the impact would be very low.
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Old 04-26-2012, 01:59 PM   #246
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Gillnets are regulated way better than sports. All our fish actually get counted I bet only about 50 percent of sports fish actually get counted. If sports cared about the fish and the cca cared they wouldn't of put on the ballot "MAINTAIN ALLOCATION" that right there shows they still want to kill esa listed salmon.

selective =/= regulated
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Old 04-26-2012, 02:49 PM   #247
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If the sportys are so worried about saving fish why do they need to have a year round catch and release fishery on sturgeon? What good comes out of this to a fish?
None that I can think of. I don't C&R sturgeon, I fish them to eat them. And it's been a while since any one of us filled a tag (that's five(5), for an entire year). But they didn't ask me.

What good comes out of catching them in a net? And how many are caught "incidentally" in a year by non-sportsman?

Quote:
And why not single barbless hook on spring salmon?
Why not? We have to use them in the ocean. Again, they didn't ask me.

I'm sure the commercials would happily agree to using much smaller nets, with much larger mesh? Same "net" effect, right? (Sorry, couldn't resist). We'd each just lose more of the fish we encountered. Oh wait, the nets, unlike the sportsman, still couldn't tell the difference between a clipped and unclipped fish, could they?

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Barbed treble hooks can't be good on a wild fish you let go after digging out of its gills!
In thirty years I have never seen a fish hooked in the gills by a plug. It may happen, but I've never seen it. All over in the face and head, but not back beyond the gill plate. Bait is a different story, but I don't use trebs with bait. Now, having said that, it wouldn't bother me if the only time you could use barbed treble hooks was when it is open for retention of unclipped fish. But again, they didn't ask me.

How much good is it for those wild fish that get caught in a net?

We are all in this together. Both sides should be willing to give up something if it would make the difference.

Or, we can just keep pointing fingers, proclaiming it's someone else's fault or responsibility until everyone except those precious Sea Lions lose their access to the resource.
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Old 04-26-2012, 05:04 PM   #248
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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If seines don't work (but they will) there are many other options before gill nets. How about they open hook-and-line commercial fishing? Allow anyone who wishes to purchase a commercial license and fish rod and reel. If removing hatchery fish is the mission let everyone participate. The impacts on wild fish would be greatly reduced.
Your not even from Oregon. You've never seen a Columbia river gillnet nor have you seen a Seine work.
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Old 04-26-2012, 05:37 PM   #249
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Exclamation Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

Grim- c'mon now.... We've just got to the point where we were actually starting to get along with you.... And then you go and say somethin like this? He's been around a LOOONG time- just because he lives elsewhere most CERTAINLY does not mean he does not know what's going on around here locally....

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Old 04-26-2012, 05:57 PM   #250
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Sports have killed way more sturgeon and salmon this year than gillnets!
Can't use that fact anymore! Because if you do the math on how much sport fisherman catch keepers compared to how many gill netters harvest keepers, gill netters average way better during a season per boat. And Remember sport fisherman are only allowed 5 sturgeon per year (if they're lucky) in both states. How many can a netter harvest? So the ratio favors the few who stretch that curtain of death across the Columbia!
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Old 04-26-2012, 06:13 PM   #251
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Your not even from Oregon. You've never seen a Columbia river gillnet nor have you seen a Seine work.
I'm a nate, SGR. Wanna see my fin?
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Old 04-26-2012, 06:21 PM   #252
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

I just did a google search on "seine nets outlawed", WOW, this initiative will go nowhere with that kind of ammo, read it for yourself before you vote.The links to Florida and India are especially disheartening, not what we need for the Columbia. Bill
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Old 04-26-2012, 07:15 PM   #253
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The states of Oregon and Washington just sent out applications for bids on tagging of Sturgeon for 2012. They sent then to gillnetters with gillnets. Thats how worried they are about impacts, on oversize, legals, or undersize. The federal government does the same thing to get data on the endangered Green Sturgeon.

Bycatch is considered to be irrelevant.
So the spring bycatch during the winter sturgeon gillnet fishery is irrelevant?
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Old 04-26-2012, 07:35 PM   #254
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Reality is uncomfortable to me. This all started with the premiss that the alternative fishing method would be to lower impacts on wild fish. When it started to look like maybe the seine fishery would accomplish that the CCA swung into action, rewriting the initiative to maintain their current allocation. To hell with the fish or impacts from the sports, or any efforts on behalf of the hookers to reduce their impacts.

Just "maintain the allocation".
You are making several presumptions that are unproven.
CCA was here before the BPA sent the funding to the states for testing. Keonings turned down the money in 2007, when cca chapters were certified. The rewrite was already in play because the secretary of State gave them a lousy title. I argued from the beginning that reducing wild impacts does not warrant the reward of another persons opportunity. The only reward you ever get from Govt for complying with a law is the ability to continue business or other activities. Anglers want wild fish to recover. The states and the Feds can make anglers change gear anytime they want, or just close the river to fishing, which is done thru administrative channels. Washington has already approved a single barbless hook requirement and it did not go into effect because Oregon (whomever opposed it) would not adopt the change. Eyefish has a viable solution and its apparently illegal to use it in Oregon. So, someone in Oregon needs to WAKE UP. The legislation will only increase the demands on anglers to lower their impacts. The question I have for you... Will you see the light and except reality, then support the efforts to switch tribal gillnets to other gear, or will you occupy the capital and support the unnecessary death of 12.5% of the wild impacts?
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Old 04-26-2012, 08:01 PM   #255
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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So the spring bycatch during the winter sturgeon gillnet fishery is irrelevant?
I think so, what do you think? Doesn't really matter though.

Why not leave fish management up to the fish managers?

Maybe you should check with the guys in Florida, before you answer me.
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Old 04-26-2012, 09:16 PM   #256
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I'm not a biologist but I think hook/line commercial fishing could be done with very small impacts. Using multiple fairly heavy rods so that you could bring the fish to hand quickly, typical braided line, single barbless hooks for quick release, I suspect the impact would be very low.
http://www.oregonlive.com/environmen...al_from_l.html
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Old 04-26-2012, 11:13 PM   #257
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Does anyone know why the CCA thinks that seines nets are a better option than gillnets. These nets still are not selective and will catch both wild fish and hatchery fish. If I understand things correctly, the impacts on "wild" fish are what matters. If seine nets work better and kill less wild fish, than that will mean the seine nets will actually be out there more than the gillnets are now AND be taking more hatchery fish out of the system. I dont get it. It seems like the ballot box is not the place to try to handle wildlife/fish management...what next? Will some group decide to try to ban bowhunting? The bear and cougar hunting ban has not gone so well for Oregon.

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Old 04-26-2012, 11:28 PM   #258
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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I think so, what do you think? Doesn't really matter though.

Why not leave fish management up to the fish managers?

Maybe you should check with the guys in Florida, before you answer me.

No point. We have to keep correcting you, and it doesn't really matter.
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Old 04-27-2012, 07:18 AM   #259
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So it is possible for local fishermen to hook & line catch salmon for sale to people who don't fish themselves. Does that mean people can go to the market and buy salmon even if gillnets go away?

Someone has been lying to us.
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Old 04-27-2012, 07:44 AM   #260
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Does anyone know why the CCA thinks that seines nets are a better option than gillnets. These nets still are not selective and will catch both wild fish and hatchery fish. If I understand things correctly, the impacts on "wild" fish are what matters. If seine nets work better and kill less wild fish, than that will mean the seine nets will actually be out there more than the gillnets are now AND be taking more hatchery fish out of the system. I dont get it. It seems like the ballot box is not the place to try to handle wildlife/fish management...what next? Will some group decide to try to ban bowhunting? The bear and cougar hunting ban has not gone so well for Oregon.
Welcome to ifish Omega3, you won`t get any response from the pro initiative folks with statements like this. They have spun this idea into "a good thing for sports". News flash- seiners will not be satisfied with a couple days of spring chinook fishing, nor will they be limited to 1/2 of the lower river quota if they`re to stay in business. Remove more hatchery fish is the goal of this initiative, believing this will help sports is foolish. Bill
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Old 04-27-2012, 09:10 AM   #261
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Does anyone know why the CCA thinks that seines nets are a better option than gillnets. These nets still are not selective and will catch both wild fish and hatchery fish.
Welcome to ifish, Omega3. It isn't that the CCA "thinks" that seine nets are a better option. Seines have been tested and the preliminary results are very promising.

Seine nets for this fishery will not be used in the classic method. Instead, the nets will be drawn just tight enough to pen the fish so that they can be sorted in the water. Non-targeted species are released unharmed and barely handled.
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Old 04-27-2012, 09:47 AM   #262
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Welcome to ifish, Omega3. It isn't that the CCA "thinks" that seine nets are a better option. Seines have been tested and the preliminary results are very promising.

Seine nets for this fishery will not be used in the classic method. Instead, the nets will be drawn just tight enough to pen the fish so that they can be sorted in the water. Non-targeted species are released unharmed and barely handled.
With almost 0,zero, impact on wild fish. Just what any concerned citizen in the Northwest would support.

So lets have lots of seiners, all up and down the Columbia. Nothing to lose, get rid of the cussed hatchery fish.
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Old 04-27-2012, 10:47 AM   #263
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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With almost 0,zero, impact on wild fish. Just what any concerned citizen in the Northwest would support.
Correct. The point is to protect wild fish of a target species from unnecessarily high impacts as well as protect all non-target fish from being harmed or killed as bycatch.

Quote:
So lets have lots of seiners, all up and down the Columbia. Nothing to lose, get rid of the cussed hatchery fish.
It wouldn't take very many seine boats to accomplish the CR commercial harvest. It is already fairly small. Several boats with contracts for the lower river, a few in the mid stretch in Columbia County and maybe a few that could operate somewhere east of the airport. All could operate on contracts essentially similar to the way timber companies remove trees from federal and state lands: highly regulated, monitored and carried out in daylight with rights on the part of the boat operator to collect a certain number of fish of a certain species. All species caught would be recorded and there could also be as part of the contract rights of the state, tagging by DFW officials for research purposes, etc. This is not rocket science, it is ordinary business. Capital necessary to create the businesses might come partly from some sort of federal or state buyout program, funding by NWPPC, public private joint venture, etc.

There is no requirement to buyout or replace current gillnet licenses (no property interest under Oregon law.) Also, there is no historical precedent of compensating salmon gear owners when their gear is outlawed by initiative. The point is -- this job of commercial fishing for salmon on the CR is not some sort of entitlement to a 'quota' or to a job. It is a service industry in which certain individuals have the right to collect fish for the public, who is the user group.

With a well managed, truly mark selective salmon fishery in the CR with low impacts, managers will have much greater control over hatchery fish harvest, and a greater ability to comply with catch sharing agreements, etc.

So we agree generally. I think that is a first, Woodpecker. Good development.

GR
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Old 04-27-2012, 01:29 PM   #264
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I'm still waiting for someone to jump on my gillnet boat. And come see, with your own eyes that our nets don't catch everything in the water. Saying that is just absurd. I've been takeing alot of videos and if I can ever figure out how to post them ill be glad too. Seines are the last thing you want to see on the CR. Sports have killed more sturgeon and salmon this year than commercials have. And we are the bad guys?
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Old 04-27-2012, 07:22 PM   #265
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I agree with SGR my boat is open too!
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Old 04-27-2012, 07:39 PM   #266
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I agree with SGR my boat is open too!
I would be very interested! What do I need to have, in order for this to happen.

Please feel free to pm me with any requirements. I say this as someone who has never been on a gill net boat, let alone while one was actively fishing. I would greatly appreciate the learning experience.

I also promise not to divulge information you deem as sensitive, if any. Loose lips, sinks ships!

I have a feeling you are going to get another shot this spring. Maybe we could do it then?
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Old 04-27-2012, 07:54 PM   #267
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I would be very interested! What do I need to have, in order for this to happen.

Please feel free to pm me with any requirements. I say this as someone who has never been on a gill net boat, let alone while one was actively fishing. I would greatly appreciate the learning experience.

I also promise not to divulge information you deem as sensitive, if any. Loose lips, sinks ships!

I have a feeling you are going to get another shot this spring. Maybe we could do it then?
Your more than welcome to come along. Pm me if you here we get another opener as I will do the same. I can probably just take one person at a time cause I usally have a deckhand and state observer on board!
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Old 04-27-2012, 08:14 PM   #268
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I'm still waiting for someone to jump on my gillnet boat. And come see, with your own eyes that our nets don't catch everything in the water. Saying that is just absurd. I've been takeing alot of videos and if I can ever figure out how to post them ill be glad too. Seines are the last thing you want to see on the CR. Sports have killed more sturgeon and salmon this year than commercials have. And we are the bad guys?
Here is one for you "Grim Reeper"
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Old 04-27-2012, 10:49 PM   #269
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This is sad really. This happens everyday. How awful. Poor thing got fought on hook to death! And just released, if they had a recovery box on board it would of had a better chance of survival. But lucky for a sealion that fish didn't put up any kind of a chase.
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Old 04-27-2012, 11:43 PM   #270
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This is sad really. This happens everyday. How awful. Poor thing got fought on hook to death! And just released, if they had a recovery box on board it would of had a better chance of survival. But lucky for a sealion that fish didn't put up any kind of a chase.
No comment on that! But looks like another impact too me?
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Old 04-28-2012, 05:27 AM   #271
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No comment on that! But looks like another impact too me?
That is definitely an impact. That probably didn't get accounted for.
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Old 04-28-2012, 05:57 AM   #272
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

All users (including non-fishers such as Ag and hydro) have an impact. All impacts are figured in and accounted for by the DFW's. They have some pretty complicated formulas that spit out those numbers. If you have any concerns about it then you may wish to contact one of them.
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Old 04-28-2012, 08:11 AM   #273
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All users (including non-fishers such as Ag and hydro) have an impact. All impacts are figured in and accounted for by the DFW's. They have some pretty complicated formulas that spit out those numbers. If you have any concerns about it then you may wish to contact one of them.
And the "pretty complicated formulas" will change in the near future because the messiahs from the selective fishing crowd stirred the pot.
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Old 04-28-2012, 02:38 PM   #274
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And the "pretty complicated formulas" will change in the near future because the messiahs from the selective fishing crowd stirred the pot.
Nothing new. The Feds already had this plan on the drawing board before the State Boards were established.
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Old 04-28-2012, 06:09 PM   #275
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Sports have the same impact or even a greater impact than commercials. Commercials don't have a catch and release season for Sturgeon. We use our nets for research to tag the sturgeon. If the states thought nets kill the sturgeon you think they would use nets? A catch and release season for sports is one of the first things that needs to be stopped. Also all sports or at least guide boats should be required to have on board a recovery box. And use it! Why shut down a user group that generates millions of dollars into the economy when the real problems are the predators! Birds kill almost half of the smolts every year!
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Old 04-28-2012, 06:16 PM   #276
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

What does that have to do with switching from gillnets to seines? Nothing....
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Old 04-28-2012, 08:24 PM   #277
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What does that have to do with switching from gillnets to seines? Nothing....
I didn't know this was the switching from gillnets to seines thread.
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Old 04-28-2012, 10:21 PM   #278
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I'm a nate, SGR. Wanna see my fin?
Yeah but you are an ex-pat living in Central America that can't seem to quit chimming in on Columbia River fisheries - when was the last time you caught a springer on the good old CR? Or saw a seine net working on the Columbia River with your own eyes?
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Old 04-29-2012, 01:48 AM   #279
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

Who put you in charge?
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Old 04-29-2012, 06:57 AM   #280
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Sports have the same impact or even a greater impact than commercials. Commercials don't have a catch and release season for Sturgeon. We use our nets for research to tag the sturgeon. If the states thought nets kill the sturgeon you think they would use nets? A catch and release season for sports is one of the first things that needs to be stopped. Also all sports or at least guide boats should be required to have on board a recovery box. And use it! Why shut down a user group that generates millions of dollars into the economy when the real problems are the predators! Birds kill almost half of the smolts every year!
I knew there would be something we agreed on. Targeting a species to be caught and released amounts to nothing more than fatal harassment. Some fish will be caught unintentionally while fishing for other species, but intentional targeting should be stopped.

I'm fine with guide boats needing to include their catch in the commercial allotment, but don't see the need for a recovery box. Guide boats catch fish by hook which can be released without leaving the water. That's much different treatment than a fish gets stuck in a gillnet.
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Old 04-29-2012, 07:04 AM   #281
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Yeah but you are an ex-pat living in Central America that can't seem to quit chimming in on Columbia River fisheries - when was the last time you caught a springer on the good old CR? Or saw a seine net working on the Columbia River with your own eyes?
Don't matter where Crabby hangs his hat. He has knowledge and interest in the subject and has as much right to voice his opinion as anyone else on the board, including you and me.
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Old 04-29-2012, 10:13 AM   #282
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I knew there would be something we agreed on. Targeting a species to be caught and released amounts to nothing more than fatal harassment. Some fish will be caught unintentionally while fishing for other species, but intentional targeting should be stopped.

I'm fine with guide boats needing to include their catch in the commercial allotment, but don't see the need for a recovery box. Guide boats catch fish by hook which can be released without leaving the water. That's much different treatment than a fish gets stuck in a gillnet.
Have you watched the video above? That right there shows me they need recovery boxes. But with the amount of blood coming I don't think anything would of helped
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Old 04-29-2012, 05:47 PM   #283
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

Time to stop the fight to death BS. There are plenty of catch and release waters including some fish for pay and they dont have a big dead loss issue that i know of. Just saw a special on a lake in southern Oregon for catching trout and those fish gets caught over and over again. Yes Im sure some do die....yes bird do eat alot....yes sea lions do eat alot(hey theres a forum for that also. This thread is for gill nets and what people think of them. Lets STOP changing the subject deflecting it on to sporties and other factors. Hey Ive got an idea....start a thread about sporties and what you think of them.
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Old 04-29-2012, 08:32 PM   #284
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Time to stop the fight to death BS. There are plenty of catch and release waters including some fish for pay and they dont have a big dead loss issue that i know of. Just saw a special on a lake in southern Oregon for catching trout and those fish gets caught over and over again. Yes Im sure some do die....yes bird do eat alot....yes sea lions do eat alot(hey theres a forum for that also. This thread is for gill nets and what people think of them. Lets STOP changing the subject deflecting it on to sporties and other factors. Hey Ive got an idea....start a thread about sporties and what you think of them.
That thread wouldn't last 3 minutes
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Old 04-29-2012, 08:39 PM   #285
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Arrow Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

Or better yet posts about what fish we all prefer to eat.......
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Old 04-29-2012, 10:15 PM   #286
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Can't use that fact anymore! Because if you do the math on how much sport fisherman catch keepers compared to how many gill netters harvest keepers, gill netters average way better during a season per boat. And Remember sport fisherman are only allowed 5 sturgeon per year (if they're lucky) in both states. How many can a netter harvest? So the ratio favors the few who stretch that curtain of death across the Columbia!
Dude, are you for real? Sports get 80% of the harvest!
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Old 04-30-2012, 12:13 AM   #287
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

I'm having a hard time understanding the logic behind this CCA seine net proposal. The federal government sets the impacts for the amount of wild fish that can be killed, that number gets divided up between the tribes, sport fisherman and gillneters right? If the gillnetters switch to seines, wont they still be killing the same amount of wild fish with their seines? There is no way that a seine net wont have some kind of mortality rate associated with it. So what is the point? A seine net is not really more selective than a gillnet.. or a hook for that matter. It catches both "wild" and hatchery fish and will have a release mortality rate assigned to it..even fish caught with a hook and line have a release mortality rate assigned to them. I'm not getting this.
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Old 04-30-2012, 06:07 AM   #288
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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I'm having a hard time understanding the logic behind this CCA seine net proposal. The federal government sets the impacts for the amount of wild fish that can be killed, that number gets divided up between the tribes, sport fisherman and gillneters right? If the gillnetters switch to seines, wont they still be killing the same amount of wild fish with their seines? There is no way that a seine net wont have some kind of mortality rate associated with it. So what is the point? A seine net is not really more selective than a gillnet.. or a hook for that matter. It catches both "wild" and hatchery fish and will have a release mortality rate assigned to it..even fish caught with a hook and line have a release mortality rate assigned to them. I'm not getting this.
First, the initiative to ban the use of gillnets in the CR is not a "CCA seine net proposal". Besides prohibiting gillnets and preventing any decrease in current allocations, the measure permits the use of selective, live capture gear. The two DFW have been testing modified seining for several years and the results have been very good, with immediate mortalities at a small fraction of the rate attributed to gillnets. Bycatch steelhead and sturgeon can easily be released unharmed. So "yes" a seine used in this modified fashion (live release of bycatch before hauling) is FAR more selective and safe than a gillnet. And that is the point.
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Old 04-30-2012, 10:05 AM   #289
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The two DFW have been testing modified seining for several years and the results have been very good, with immediate mortalities at a small fraction of the rate attributed to gillnets. Bycatch steelhead and sturgeon can easily be released unharmed.
Since you know that the testing has been very good, please share the data with all of us. I haven't heard or seen any numbers yet, where are they?
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Old 04-30-2012, 11:55 AM   #290
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Since you know that the testing has been very good, please share the data with all of us. I haven't heard or seen any numbers yet, where are they?
There is no number. They have done a mortality test yet. She has no clue.
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Old 04-30-2012, 12:11 PM   #291
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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Since you know that the testing has been very good, please share the data with all of us. I haven't heard or seen any numbers yet, where are they?
Yes! Please share. No more Vague comments about the survival rate. This thing will never pass without survival rates. Some voters are stupid sheep, but the 20% that will decide this want actual data.
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Old 04-30-2012, 01:50 PM   #292
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Yes! Please share. No more Vague comments about the survival rate. This thing will never pass without survival rates. Some voters are stupid sheep, but the 20% that will decide this want actual data.
Talk about pulling numbers out from somewhere..... 20% will decide and want actual data? I'd put it more like 0.02% want actual data and the majority will vote on who did the best ad.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:13 PM   #293
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Talk about pulling numbers out from somewhere..... 20% will decide and want actual data? I'd put it more like 0.02% want actual data and the majority will vote on who did the best ad.
True there...but the ads are only made for the 20% undecideded and whoever has some verifiable data to prove they are right will have the best ads.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:20 PM   #294
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True there...but the ads are only made for the 20% undecideded and whoever has some verifiable data to prove they are right will have the best ads.
Thanks for your actual data on the number of undecideds.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:32 PM   #295
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Thanks for your actual data on the number of undecideds.
You can play Devils Advocate all you want, but you know exactly what I'm talking about...When any divisive Oregon ballot measure comes up for a vote (or Demo/Repub election) about 40% vote one way and 40% the other no matter what...their minds are made up and no ad, robo call, or badgering will change their mind. And then the other 20% decide the vote.
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Old 04-30-2012, 02:39 PM   #296
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I wonder what the other 20% think about 40% mortality rates.
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Old 04-30-2012, 05:08 PM   #297
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I wonder what the other 20% think about 40% mortality rates.
What about 50% compliance during the willamete sturgeon season?
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Old 04-30-2012, 06:14 PM   #298
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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What about 50% compliance during the willamete sturgeon season?
You know how that turned out SGR, not quite what it was presented as. Keep focused, no need to attack sports nor guides. Tell us about how coho "harden" up when they enter freshwater, and what it would mean to live capture them during this transition{raining scales comments**. Bill
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Old 04-30-2012, 06:25 PM   #299
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You know how that turned out SGR, not quite what it was presented as. Keep focused, no need to attack sports nor guides. Tell us about how coho "harden" up when they enter freshwater, and what it would mean to live capture them during this transition{raining scales comments**. Bill
The fish rub against the hard mesh they use for seines. Its like rubbing it on a chain link fence. Scales fly right off.
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Old 04-30-2012, 06:33 PM   #300
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Default Re: The Only Gillnet thread - Part III

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The fish rub against the hard mesh they use for seines. Its like rubbing it on a chain link fence. Scales fly right off.

Are you calling all the officials who conducted the testing for the last 3-4 years, liars?
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