coho-nook

[husker]

Anybody see Bill Monroes article at oregonlive today? Bill says they have what they think is a mixed breed fish, which looks like a coho and has spots and big adipose like a nook. graemlins/lurk.gif

Try and explain that to an officer. Yeah I tagged it as a nook see the spots and adipose. Nope your wrong look at the gum line definitely white. Heres your ticket give me the fish. :shrug: graemlins/icon_argue.gif

[ 11-20-2003, 07:37 AM: Message edited by: husker ]

[jokester]

There was a thread going on about these "cross breeds" when the fishing was hot at B10. I did a search on it, but couldn't find it. Quite a few guys that were down there were saying that they caught fish that had the characteristics of one species, but turned out to be the other :shrug:

-jokester

[Miss B Haven]

Remember- regardless of other characteristics, the fish checkers/game guys ONLY go by the lower gum line. Whether it's a freek, cross breed or whatever, use the gum line for keeping/tagging identification.

[ 11-20-2003, 08:26 AM: Message edited by: Miss B Haven ]

[jokester]

Remember- regardless of other characteristics, the fish checkers/game guys ONLY go by the lower gum line. Whether it's a freek, cross breed or whatever, use the gum line for keeping/tagging identification.<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">Right on Miss B!! That's what the gamies are looking for and you'll get a ticket otherwise, no matter what other distinct markings the fish has!

-jokester

[Ty]

I ran into this when I was a creel sampler in Tillimook Bay.

Not to rain on anyone's parade, I know coho-chinook hybrids exsist, but not real common.

Identify, identify, identify! Key charachteristics gentlemen. Secondary sex charachteristics for coho and chinook bucks are large adipose fins.

The gum line in the best bet, although most of the time the caudal (tail) fin has spotts all the way down on chinook and only 1/32 down most the time with coho.

[Twitchs_Tackle]

Caught one of these on the ALsea about 3 weeks ago. ABout 16#, Spotted tail, large dorsal spots, mean chinook lookin' head, but whiter-than-my-legs gum line. Back it went. :whazzup:

[David Johnson]

Pretty rare in the wild. If in doubt let it go as the cops are going to look at that gum line.

Hey Ty, when are you going to be back down here?

[Ty]

Caught one of these on the ALsea about 3 weeks ago. ABout 16#, Spotted tail, large dorsal spots, mean chinook lookin' head, but whiter-than-my-legs gum line. Back it went.

Twitch = define gum line: the area where the teeth meet the mouth. Also a 16 # male coho would have a huge bulbous kype by definition.

Catch any more take a pic, then we can edentify the key char. for u.

[Miss B Haven]

Ty- I understand what you are saying but I'm afraid you may mislead someone here. The ticket givers in Oregon only use one identiying trait and that is the lower gumline. Regardless of what the other characteristics say the fish is.
I personally know (and have been standing there at the time twice) people who have gotten tickets and this is exactly what the officer told them at the time.
Funny thing is that the regs don't say that. The regs give you a bunch of characteristics (including the gum line) but in every case I know of the checkers/game officers are only going by the one.

[Ty]

Ok, in the day and age of digital camera's.....

If you know you have a chinook and it has a white gum line, simply take a picture of it. If a state trooper gives you a ticket, simply go to court with a ODFW withness to you catch's identity.

I understand the regulation, however I owuld not release a fish on these grounds or ID personally.

[Twitchs_Tackle]

Ty, I'm a senior in Fisheries at OSU. Trust me, I know what white gums look like.

(also, I have my specialty in Law Enforcement, they (OSP) look at gum line)

but hey, if the creeler says so...
(the creeler on the Santiam didn't know you didn't eat spawned out steelhead and asked why I released it)

[Ty]

Twitchs_Tackle,

Hey man, no offence intended. I ahve handled houndreds of chinook and thousands of coho both in Oregon and Alaska, before and after college, I am a proffesional in the fisheries field and feel that I need not qualify myself as a expert in the area of identification.

I have seen the mis-identification of spp in the field by profesionals, happens.

I believe you or any one else that says you are catching chinook w/ white gums, however until I see proof of the hybrid cross in a picture or pictures that are "common" I have a hard time believing it.

It may be possible that there is common hybrids, I would love to see sowm pitures or documentation.

[Kentucky Hog Hunter]

Yes... What Mel said...

In addition, I was just wondering if anyone else notices a distinct difference in the odor between a silver & a chinook???

You may think I am crazy but I feel there is a very very distinct difference. That chinook when it comes into the boat whether in salt or brackish water just has a stronger more disctint odor in my opinion.

However, I have always inspected the gum line nonetheless because in the late part of the Buoy 10 thing, 15 - 20'# silvers are not uncommon.

I am interested to hear your thoughts on my sence of smell.

[finclipped]

Mmmm tule smell :sick:

KHH, definately a difference. Although if they can't identify it with gumline, I doubt they can smell the difference.

[FallRiverGuy]

Fished with a guy this year that said the same thing about the smell. One trip in the salt this year, the only chinook we caught he smell identified it before we had a chance to look at the gums.

[Kentucky Hog Hunter]

Cool,

That at least validates that my sence of smell is working because some people have looked at me like I was a graemlins/dork.gif but for me there is definately a distinct difference...

[Twitchs_Tackle]

Ty, no problem...

KHH: Chinook stink. :grin:

[swampy]

I've caught a coho-nook.I think. A few years back at Tillamook we'd put a couple nooks in the box , the bite was on and I hooked a fish that fought like a chinook , looked like a chinook (spots , tail,size, etc) and tagged like a chinook . Get back to the dock and proudly display our catch for the checker . He does the scale thing and all and then checked gums ...made my jaw drop..white gums.I had not checked them as it didn't even cross my to...it's a nook. We both agreed that all other signs looked nooky and he decides it a hybred . A what ?!!!? He just shakes his head and off we go wondering what we really do have having never heard of such a thing . Just before we depart he comes over to the truck and says he wants to call his boss over from Old Mill to take a look. He gets there , takes one look at the gums and called OSP. Felt pretty low all the sudden. My $300 lesson has me checking gums ALWAYS. And ever since wondering if there really is such a thing as a hybred ?

[Fast Water]

There is a 32 pound Coho in the freezer at the Region 5 office in Vancouver that came out of the EFL that is waiting DNA testing to determine it's true colors.

Gum line is white
Body color and shape is Coho

But....

Scale sample shows it is a 4 year old
Adipose is a bit large
Spots on the back are a bit large.


Looking at the photo I have no doubt that it is a monster Coho. I can't wait for the DNA report.

:smile:

[Born to be Wild]

Before you know it these hatcheries will be pumping out transvestite Oncorhynchus. :grin:

[ 11-20-2003, 10:47 PM: Message edited by: Born to be Wild ]

[crabbait]

Columbian today ran another picture of that 32lb buck and said that the scale sample results verified 4yr old Coho but they are awaiting the DNA results to see if it is a hybred.

Sure hope it spawned before it croaked!

[Born to be Wild]

Was it a wild feesh?

Post a pic Steve.

Dano

[Lil' Corkie]

Mixed breeds of fish are weird and quite possible. You'd have to look at the chromozones of the species cross breeding. :grin:

[FallRiverGuy]

Or there is a low frequency mutation that prevents pigment from forming in the gum line. I wonder if anyone has check 10,000 chinook fry to see if any have white gums.

[Ty]

Ok guys, I will try a new approach. I have been working behind a state trooper that mis-identified a coho as a pink when I was a fish checker.

So, you guys are perfectly correct in that there are fish hybrids and fish that vary in key charteristics, however you need to compare the fish side by side until you feel comfortable enough to identify them.

Here is another charteristic for you guys:

Coho have smaller caudal peduncle
(area in front of tail) in realation to chinook and a coho tail fin will collapse when you hold then with your hand for a picture and a chinook tail fish will not collapse making them much easier to hold on too.

My point is there are many different ways to identify these two species of fish. Everyone has to find their own way to identify the difference between these two species.

However as a sportman it is everyones responsibility to be able to tell the difference between coho and chinook, if you cannot the right thing to do is let them go if it is catch an release for coho.