The internet's affect on quality of life??

[Salmonator]

Ok so I'm bored :grin: Do you remember when you had to drive to the coast to find out if that last rain hit your favorite watershed? Do you remember when you couldn't find your latest tidebook and just went crabbing anyways? How about guessing about current regs because your last copy was stuffed in the corner of the boat and mildew ate it? How about driving three hours to bouy 10 and coming up skunked because you didn't have up to the hour reports on Ifish? I can honestly say that I have saved at least as much fuel for the truck and boat than I spend for broadband every month. This doesn't even count the fishing buddies and get togethers found through ifish (and other sites :wink: ). Whadda you all think?

[FishinMission]

I think that years of experience guides some better than the internet.

But I would have to admit that in my early years....I made "mistakes" in fishing judgement. Still do...as often the "need" to get out there on the water precludes the neccessity to "bonk" fish.

Pretty safe to assume there's winter stelies in the rivers from mid-Nov on, springers in the big river from late Feb. on, Springers in the Willamette (lots) from April 1 on...etc etc.

Information can be gleaned from other sources than the internet.

Tide information is in the Oregonian.

River level information is there too, along with fish counts. "Semi-current" (no pun intended) river levels are available over the phone.

Fish counts are posted in the paper, and some are available over the phone too.

All in all...You can find it all here on the "net" tho.

Just "Point and Click..."


Mark

[Salmonator]

Mark, find me a newspaper that will show you a major downpour happening right over the town of Logsden at 3:00 a.m. :whazzup: Maybe some use the power of internet better than others... :grin:

[timinthegorge]

Salmonator.... As I'm quickly approaching year 49, I agree with asking the question! Is it better now? Definitely! I remember when planning on a fishin' trip was just a hope and a prayer! We weathered any and all conditions, and fun was usually had by all, most times.... :rolleyes:

Has having more information on a more timely basis a bad thing? I think not..... graemlins/applause.gif

Having computers, and cells, and up-to-date information is definitely better than the old days! Did I just say that?? The Old Days? Jeez!

I've learned alot from many of my ifisher friends, and that certainly wouldn't have been possible without this media, and this forum. Thanks Jen!!! :cheers:

And thanks to all you Ifishers, including you, Salmonator! :grin:

[FishinMission]

Salmonator....Whatever I say..you're gonna dis-agree with anyway.

It all boils down to how bad you wanna be in the outdoors, or out in your boat, or out in nature.

What are the fish gonna do if the water blows....??

Get out of the river and walk??

Some of us change our tactics to match the conditions. Some stay home and miss out.
Not all of us HAVE to catch fish every trip, and NONE of us do all the time.

Mark

[Steelheader69]

Well, I can say this much on Salmonator's defense FishinMission. I fish mostly rivers in the Olympic National Park in the temperate rain forest. It's about a 3 hour drive for me. It's nice being able to see first hand on a graph how the water is climbing and if it's worth the drive. Yes, I'll fish in most conditions. But there are days the river has went over it's banks in the + on the graph. A bad thing. Unless I plan to use a gaff and 3# weights to hold the baby down on the bottom. I know when you try to plunk an 8ounce weight and it drifts like a small piece of pencil lead, it's running too fast.

Yes, you have the paper and such. But nice to see up to the minute weather and river conditions. I never go off reports (guide or private) unless I know them personally. Too many inflated reports out there. Have fished rivers that were "slow" and "best to stay home" that were hot. Vice versa can be said too. I have my tidebook so I can tell when best time to launch on certain rivers. I still go off my knowledge of routinely fishing same rivers when best time to hit rivers. But the final key comes to if water is near worth fishing in. I'll fish up to flood stage. But once she breaks the bank and rises, best to stay off it (just for pure danger of what breaks loose).

Say it this way. The internet has given alot of rookies out there a TON of info that they'd take years to accumulate in matter of hours. Plus, has given key holes to some good rivers as well.

[Salmonator]

Mission, once again you're missing the point. If you want to talk about it I got e-mail (another one of those convenient do-hickies that make life easier :grin: ) Especially if you want to teach a cracker how to catch one of those portland area urb's I hear so much about but have never fished for... :smile:

[timinthegorge]

SH69.... as I grew up with jets flyin' over my house, and fishin' Your rivers, it's all true!

The fact is, rookies have an advantage with this new technology, but who do they have an advantage over? YOU? I don't believe it, or concede it.

Come on.... get over it. It'll never be like it Was, and it won't ever be again, at least like you remember...

You should be ok with that.... Or not.... That's for you to decide.... I hope that after you think about it a minute, you'll have a smile....

IMHO..... Tim :bowdown:

[Steelheader69]

LOL Tim, you totally misread my post. I know for a fact they don't have anything over me, just more facts more accesible for them to read. That's all I meant by it. I have a wealth of info that i know they'll like have a hard time really getting. Plus, if you driftfish you have to learn the feel of a rock vs a bite. Only experience can really tell that. I just simply said that rookies have it easier (really helps the learning curve).

I don't want to go back (except for the quality of fishing when I first started fishing). I've been able to help buddies out by calling them on my cell and letting them know the rivers punched (though the guage was marginally correct). Saved my buddy a long drive to the Hoh (I only drive from Tacoma, he has to come from Black Diamond). Technologywise, never would want to come back, and never infered. I just wonder how many of these newer guys would truly fish if what is here wasn't around. I know alot of guys who gave up pretty fast (mostly because they were using wrong gear).

[FishinMission]

You cannot argue with internet "data". Rivers can fall as fast as they rise. But "reports" can work both ways.

Looking at the 10-90 situation...90% may be reporting slow days, when those other 10% may be catching fish. And remember...some of those 10% don't blab their successes here, either.

Granted, inexperienced fisherfolks can glean alot of info here, butI'll stick with my guns when saying there's no substitute for experience.

'Nator....if you wanna lesson..get in touch with me about the third week of August..and I'll school ya. I know we butt heads often, but we'd probably get along just fine. I'm not such a bad guy, just a little rough around the edges when it comes to being tactful at expressing my views. Safe to say..most know what I'm thinking. I usually come right out and say it. Sometimes regretting it later, but most often, not.

:rolleyes:

Mark

[ 05-13-2003, 02:15 PM: Message edited by: FishinMission ]

[boater]

Originally posted by Salmonator:
Whadda you all think? <font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">i think you should be at bouy 10 ****** **th. to the **, its usualy good then, at least it has been for the past 30 years on those dates.

[Salmonator]

Sorry, what I meant was "whadda you all (except boater) think?? graemlins/dork.gif

[boater]

salmonator, here`s one for you to think about..why does a seagull stand on one leg once in a while ?

[Hogmaster]

At the risk of getting back to the question at hand, sure the fingertip information is better. When people see that 2 inches of rain fell on Logsden they stay away in droves. Then the few that go anyway often find it was a deluge JUST over Logsden and the river isn't blown at all!

The point being that sometimes too much credence is put into weather and especially fishing reports. Remember, inherently a fishing report is old news. What happened at the Hospital Hole today doesn't mean squat about how it will fish tomorrow.

Just go, be willing to change methods with the conditions and something good might happen. And if the catching sucks, the fishing can still be good!

:cheers:

[ 05-13-2003, 09:43 PM: Message edited by: Hogmaster ]

[Tanner]

As far as the affect on quality of life in my eyes:
I have noticed that since this website (and others) has become so popular, The quality of the overall fishing experience for me has gone down.

I know you guys have been discussing this from an information gathering standpoint where I am looking at it from the standpoint of many areas that used to get small amounts of pressure, all of a sudden getting more pressure than they can really handle.

Just this winter, on a certain stretch of river that I cherish, I saw the boat traffic increase threefold (at least). There was more than once that I fished for March Natives during the middle of the week and the river was what I would consider crowded. Just a year ago I would do the same float during the middle of the week and maybe see one or two other boats.
This is why the only reports I will post are generic ones or ones on a fishery that is already crowded or a fishery that I know no-one is really going to care about.

The internet has become a great tool for information gathering, but I believe it has already done some harm to the quality of the fishing experience and will continue to do more if people are not more careful.

Just my
.02 cents

[Hogmaster]

Salmonator, I agree, if the data shows a rising muddy river I usually don't go either. But the real danger is then I go to places like Fry's, Costco or a furniture store! I wish it were $25!!! :shocked: :shocked: :shocked:

Tanner, one thing that I have noticed in my 17 years of fishing in this area. The number of BOATS has exploded in general. So sure, someone posting a hot tip on a small stream will have an impact, but even on zipperlipped spots that do not get mentioned on web sites, the amount of boat traffic has increased literally exponentially. Think about how many people have boats that didn't have them 10 years ago. And think about all those that did have boats 10 years ago that now have newer boats. What happened to the old boats? Sure, some of them may be out there at that salvage yard on the way to Chinook Landing, but most are now in someone else's driveway or garage and still being used.

I am not suggesting that the internet has not lessoned the problem. After all, all those boaters want to go SOMEWHERE, and the hot spot is the likely spot to try, right? It is just that they would be there in most cases anyway. Who doesn't know the lower river in March and April, the middle river in April and May and the upper river in June? If you are a drift boater, you are going to hit the coastal streams for Winters in December and January. Fish work on a calendar and so do fishermen and women...

[Nanook]

http://www.jokemonster.com/images/130.gif

[ 05-14-2003, 06:03 PM: Message edited by: ****** ]

[Salmonator]

Originally posted by Tanner:


The internet has become a great tool for information gathering, but I believe it has already done some harm to the quality of the fishing experience and will continue to do more if people are not more careful.

<font size="2" face="verdana,arial,helvetica">Agreed..

[Salmonator]

How about another scenario :rolleyes: You see that the siletz is 7.3 and dropping slow because you have up to the hour readings from a website. You then see those real nasty red and yellow nexrad clouds pounding rain on your watershed (you know where the watershed is because the nexrad map shows county lines to reference with). Get fancy graemlins/dork.gif and run the radar loop and watch the direction those nasty rains are headed. 9 times out of 10 the river WILL be blown out and I've never had a good days fishing the Siletz 8'and rising with a chocolate brown hue. Hogmaster, you can go brown-water rafting if you like especially if you have fun. I'll wake up at 4am, spend 5 minutes on the 'puter to figure this out, make a few phone calls then climb back in bed without feeling like I missed out on anything. Plus I'll have the $25 bucks I would have spent on gas and take it to the golf course instead :hoboy: So much for saving money huh?? :blush:

[happybrew]

Work affects my lack of fishing much more than the internet does. Last fall, I wanted to hit Eagle Creek for Salmon, but the lack of rain deterred me. I watched the river levels when the rain came, and when the smaller creeks in that area rose about 6 inches, I figured Eagle Creek rose enough for the fish to come in. Sure enough, they were there and I got my fish. Had I just looked at the clouds, and guessed how much the creeks rose, I would have stayed home. For Green Peter, it has helped with what works and what doesn't and how deep the fish are. With Big Cliff Reservoir, I'd say that it has hurt the fishing because everyone and their brother doesn't need to find the Thursday paper to know when they stocked it. Stocking it has increased the fishing pressure, and seriously reduced what was a fine native fish population. Last year, I got a few planters there, and didn't have the continual reeling in of native trout that I used to have there. I went there one day and found forty people on the bank, whereas before I rarely saw anyone there. On the other hand, I knew that they stocked Silverton Reservoir heavily prior to Memorial Day last year, and had some fun catching those hatchery trout prior to that weekend. So I'd say it's a mixed bag. In general, it has helped more than it has hurt.

Doug

[West Linn Wader]

I think Hogmaster is closer to the mark regarding quality of life. More people + more boats + higher unemployment + more accurate info = more pressure but I don't think the net or Ifish is the main contributor. On the other hand what do I know?

WLW

[Steelheader69]

No, it's not just Ifish that's doing it. Every board has had an effect on it. Plus, there are zippers that remain unscathed. NO, I will not post to prove it again. LOL. But seriously, there are more people fishing. But more people will try harder and longer since they have more access to knowledge. Not bad at all, just that some have no idea what they are doing, and as Tanner says, the quality of the day goes downhill. I've seen too many grab rod/reel and hit the local hotspot with a boat. Pretty soon, they're fishing through prime waters and missing the mark. Then anchoring IN the hole making it impossible to fish.

I'm all for info on techs, but not on run timing/locations. Well known are just that. WELL KNOWN. Plenty of people to email about it and get info without posting out for all those out there who are too chicken to ask via email. Some lurk, and get their info that way.

I know some rivers extremely well. Some are rivers not known for fly fishing. Some guys know I have property on them, and hound me for info on good slots to fish. Well, if you know how to read water, you can easily find them as you float along. Problem is, most can't do this. They've let the hands on learning go out the door and want the when/where/how aspect handed to them.

No need to knock a particular site. All have had reports of one thing or another. But, I believe in learning the old fashioned way. I learned alot of my river knowledge the hard way, going out and scouting. I got some info from my Dad of course, but at same time he wanted me to learn how to fish a location. Not just "Son, cast into that slot and take out all the slack".

[Flatfish]

The explosion in numbers of fisherman could not be blamed upon the net. How a small fishery( and I feel your pain Tanner) is affected by pressure is another story. It is a big part of the reason that we got the sled. I really enjoy rowing a boat. But I do not like to row around others. On the coast this has become the norm. So the big rivers and a sled is my answer to that.

The pressure on the fisheries seems to be a bit more sophisticated than it was 20 years ago, as a whole. But the top 10% still do the most damage. But to get to that 10%ile is easier today with all the information than it was a generation ago.The techniques are getting easier too. Maybe more user friendly is a better term.

Mark and the dog.

[Jennie@ifish]

Do remember, however, whether increased fishing pressure be blamed on the net, or whatever...
We need more fishermen as a whole to take an interest in fishing, in order to act as interested parties, or else fishing will get less support when we need to fight for our fishing rights.

When I am on the river, and it is crowded, I feel like every boat on the river is someone who shares my love and passion for fishing, and gives me a more powerful feeling that we, as a larger group, CAN and WILL make a difference!

Jen

[FASTWATER]

Right on Jennie I always like to think of everyone as comradies not competition and I think the internet is a good thing, I have been a 10% for my years before these bulletin boards appeared and still find lots of great info.and have meet some really nice people who have become friends viva the boards,how can you not like it!!!PEACE