Snagging

[hawgcatcher]

While watching Channel 2 news this AM, Grant McCommie, showed Big Creek at Knappa. He had pictures of the fantastic amount of salmon going up stream. Then pictures of the people fishing there in the shallow waters for the Chinook. Ah yes then comes the snaggers. His companion was an OSP officer. We watched one young man land a snagged fish and release it. Then comes a guy who lands a snagged fish and heads downstream with it. The officer steps out from behind the trees and bushes and sez, "Sir, could you step over here a minute?" We listen to his lame excuse of having landed several and then "I just wanted to get out of here". I wonder if the $300 ticket upset him or being on the camera, in front of all his friends and neigbors. The officer was not happy about being tied down to Baby Sitting Big Creek due to the snaggers. I think that if more snaggers were put on camera, the amount would shrink.

Good job Grant. images/icons/shocked.gif

[boater]

[ 09-08-2001: Message edited by: boater ]

[BUGLEMAN]

Boater you might reconsider "turning the scum in". Just consider this point. The State Bulls keep getting calls from worry warts or just concerned citizens and they don't want to keep going to the "snag hole" they have other more pressing issues to contend with. The thing is to police our own ranks (which can lead to confrontations). As a know snagger lands the fish, I preferr to say things like, Oh darn that one is snagged. Next thing you know they just leave. Or just leave well enough alone and mind your own business. But calling the police or gammies will only lead to closures if the problem is rampant. Oh well there is other views I am sure.

[Trick]

I tell ya', these scum are giving us a really bad name. I'm not sure if I feel this spot on 2 was good for us as a whole. Remember the cougar in a tree surrounded by dogs? That election stopped cougar hunts in Oregon with dogs.

Can you see the netters showing this footage during the next election of "sportfisherman" ****** a resource to the general public. Give some more ammo to PETA. Maybe Greenpeace will participate in our destruction.

Really sad....Remember boys and girls, peer pressure goes along ways. we need to help these people clean up their act. Show a snagger how to really fish. If everyone would take the challenge to "adopt" one person a year and turn them around. I have a coworker that has a snagging problem and I've given him lures and techniques that will help him get them in the mouth, not near the mouth. He actually was very excited that someone took the time to show him how to do it. Alot of these snaggers are people that are new to fishing and are taking the easiest path to ground. Most probally didn't have the luxury of childhood lessons like many of us had.

Maybe we should set up an Adopt A Snagger program.
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[ 09-08-2001: Message edited by: Trick ]

[fishbait]

I hate snagging....Let me be perfectly clear about that.....BUT.. what is better in this year of overabundance........someone taking home a snagged fish and putting it to good use OR having hundreds of excess fish show up at the hatchery and be trucked into the woods and buried..... this is a tough question we will have to face more times than once this year.............

[sinker]

Fishbait, your post reminds me of whats going on on the Quilcene right now. It's snagger city up there. I heard a couple weeks ago that the hatchery had shut off the weir and were just letting the fish wait outside or head up river.
Bunch of guys over on the other board are ******** about the snaggers up there. The problem I have with the idiots is they're teaching they're kids how to do it. When I seen that is when I called the gamies. One kid told me that you could keep 2 sangged fish. I asked him where the hell he'd heard that. His reply was that his dad told him.
I tried to straighten him out but I think he believed his pops before he believed me.
Friday guys were whining about the indians up at the hatchery with dip nets leaving with truckloads of fish. My response was at least someone is getting use of them. I'd rather see that than thousands of them rotting in the river. I understand that the carcasses do the river good but man the fish are thick in there. Probly end up as a cess pool.

[Deleted User]

No excuse for snagging! Over abundance or not it brings out the dregs of society.
Stew

[ 09-09-2001: Message edited by: BIGSTEW ]

[Deleted User]

Snagging must be thwarted any way we can. Period! The excess fish are not destined to be taken by the states and buried somewhere; where did you get that idea fishbait? It would be much better to have the excess fish sold to pet food companies to generate much needed dept. revenues, and the brats not caught or making it back into the hatchery ponds become important stream nutrients for native and hatchery fry and smolts, than to allow or ignore snagging!!! The last thing we want to do is promote more adult lowlife snaggers and future generations of snaggers by turning our backs on them, or be accepting of it! Because that is definitely what is happening - growing numbers of snaggers getting away with it; that will be out there, sometimes teaching their kids this, snagging away when the cycle of fish runs get back to low returns again. I just can not see any way to rationalize allowing butt snaggers, regardless of the abundance of fish for awhile. No way! I would also much rather see the Indians get dip netted excess hatchery fish than allow snagging. The Treaties and the Federal Court review cases have mandated that if one group between the Indians and non-Indians get more fish in a given year then the other group is to get more opportunity the following year. The Indians, NMFS, and the wussies in Washington D.C. have pretty much ignored this legal mandate, just as they have the mandated 50/50 split of fish. But all these fish taken by the Indians will someday come around to be weighed in on how the rules will be interpreted and even voted on in the future. DON'T allow snagging, and snaggers on news station film, to hurt the sportfisher's causes with such negative images for the general and non-fishing public to see before elections!!!!! Wake up! Amen.

[ 09-10-2001: Message edited by: RT ]

[bigshark]

Snaggers put us all in jeopardy.....I don't see where anyone wins out of this kind of thing. No one would spite a guy trying to feed his starving family....but there is a lot of better ways to put food on the table than snagging....Ever look at the rig that snagger drives, had to have equipment to snag with...its not free....how about the gas to get him there...etc. etc. Nope, I think the only way to stop it is to make it too stiff a fine for Mr. Snagger to pay.
We get taxed on a sliding scale....lets hit snaggers the same way....You make this much gross income Mr. Snagger, its going to cost you this percent for this violation. Next time its twice that amount plus the rig and equipment you used to get there and do your act. Third time you will never have a licence to fish legally or illegally in this state and this is how much time you will
spend behind bars. Heck' I think I'm letting them off easy.........Roy Bean would have hanged him!

Its late and I post this not completely serious....But it is a no-win deal for all
concerned and I think $300 which is a lot of money just isn't enough to swat the snagger across the snout and really get his attention. How about a gaff-hook stuck in his behind for punishment? Ought to get his attention!!!!!

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[Deleted User]

Bigshark, I am completely serious - you are right on about increasing snagging fines dramatically! This would not only be a stronger deterent, but there will still be enough stupid selfish scumbags to create enough fine revenue to increase the enforcement staffing. Write to the ODFW, WDFW, and your state reps with these opinions. It's become a very important thing to do very soon; better yet, right away! ...

Also, with buddies along get in a few snaggers faces and/or camcorder filming to turn into the enforcement authorities. Let's get after this. I am also to the point of wanting to do a legal viglante 'posse' task force with about a dozen of us doing 'stings' in snagging hot spots. It is legal to carry a handgun while fishing, as well as a deterent sheathed knife on your belt. We can all go armed together, and then after observing snagging we very nicely explain that "the snagging is a major threat to our sportfishing rights, like having rivers closed and PETA efforts to close down all fishing; as well as being against the law". With a large posse there even the hardest core snaggers are going to get the message that they are in immediate or eventual trouble - both individually and for keeping rivers open. Also tell them that they have been filmed and there license plate numbers taken to be turned into authorities, and that they will be targeted by cops and vigilantes if they continue to snag. This will widely get around to snaggers very quickly. ANd they aren't about to add fighting to their snagging law breaking - but we'd be prepared to appropriately handle it. ... This has to be thwarted soon!!!

RT

[Pitch Pocket]

RT, you can't be serious about the gun and knife thing. Next thing you know we'll be reading about shootouts at the snaggin hole.

[bajaspecial]

http://www.katu.com/outdoors/story.asp?ID=30196
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[THE REEL HEY_YALL]

WHO THE HELL WOULD EVER RECONSIDER TURNING IN A GAME VIOLATION?

If they closed it because of the snaggers, I'd sleep better at night knowing our resource is safe....for the time being. Snaggers are funny creatures. They're already breaking the law, initially, so if the water becomes closed, they'll still fish it. I should say, they'll still snag it.

5 people since July 10th wished I would have reconsidered turning them in, but it's people like me that help make it where your grandkids can fish when they take up the trade.

I commend anyone who has or will report violations because enforcement is a joke with the little funding they receive.

[Nanook]

AMEN RT!

[THE REEL HEY_YALL]

sheathed

I carry my sheethead knife with me, but it's not a sheathed knife images/icons/grin.gif images/icons/wink.gif

[Trick]

One posistive note on the Big Creek issue. I had a freind that talked to a biologist the other day and there is a proposal to end fishing off the railroad trestle at the mouth.

This year is really bringing out the worse in people. I'll join the enforcement posse', when do we start?

[4Salt]

Unfortunately, you could up the fines to thousands of dollars and it wouldn't make that big a difference. As long as there is no-one to ISSUE the citations, snaggers figure that they are getting away with it, and will continue to snag. We need an ENFORCEMENT PRESENCE at these snagfests. We need to change the "look the other way" mentality with our state agencies. images/icons/mad.gif images/icons/mad.gif

[ 09-10-2001: Message edited by: 4Salt ]

[Deleted User]

SjP,

I am serious that something significant needs to be done soon; or we are at risk of rivers being closed to fishing and PETA types filming snaggers to use as propaganda to create the worst public image of sportfishers possible in efforts to stop or restrict fishing opportunities and styles. And yes I am serious about getting groups of guys together to get after snagging hotspots such as the Quilsene River up the west side of Hoods Canal, and soon the Clackamas hatchery tributary Eagle Creek. Too many to list. Most of the snaggers would succumb to a number of serious anti-snaggers with the resolve to shut them down - without a fight. But there are many lowlifes among the snaggers that could put up a fight, including possible weapons; but that is very unlikely. I rescind my angry suggestion of wearing visable weapons; but not the information that you are legal to carry them if you would feel safer in a confrontation with a number of close knit snaggers. ...

However, it's so very unlikely to ever come to any violence if a large group of guys go in with upbeat attitudes first, with flyers and verbal explainations of why the snagging must be stopped. If this doesn't stopped them we get a little firmer, call in the gammies, and take names and numbers and pics/film. It is very likely to do a lot of good. But I don't think a public forum is the place to organize a vigilante 'sting' though; say on such as the Quilsene River. But anyone wanting a good river with healthy fish in it protected from heavy daily snagging can obviously post about that river's situation (via public bulletin boards - nothing directly involving Ifish or Piscatorial). Then several guys like Trick and I can post we'd like to do something about it. Then we can communicate via e-mail and do something about it. And we can fish while we are there too. Since there's not enough money for officers and the state's legislatures lack the nads to raise the fines way up to pay for more enforcement and deterence, I think it's time we do something to clean it up - or we will be hurt in the short and long run! I have a good hunch that WA guys like 'Yall, Os, TM, and Superfly would help out with this - and surely other Oregon guys than Trick and I would be willing to help out. This would be relatively quite safe, and very ethical and beneficial, in my honest opinion. I'd even do it with a couple of appropriate guys and I'd volunteer to be the spokesman; but a half dozen guys would be better. Here is what I would say: "Hi guys. We are from the Brotherhood of Ethical Fisherman (or whatever). We've been alerted that there is a snagging problem on some rivers such as this one. We just would like to show you a better and legal way to catch these fish. We also want to alert you that game officers and volunteer anglers are going to be monitoring rivers this fall to stop illegal snagging. It's important in order to keep the rivers open and to keep our future fishing rights intact. Here are some flyers for you that you need to read, about the laws and potential upcoming situations. Any questions?" Or whatever it takes in the unlikely event that proper approach doesn't do the job! ... Joe, let me know if you guys want to do a little fishing and snagger thwarting on the Quil or wherever it's needed. I will meet you there ASAP. For the bigger snagfests such as at the Barrier dam on the Cowlitz, we should alert the gammies (who would likely show up to add credence), and we should have a couple dozen guys go in with a bullhorn and in so many words tell them the snagging party is over for the season. We could spread out (with whistles at hand) and fish along side them and help the 'mentally challenged' ones to release snagged fish.

RT

[ 09-11-2001: Message edited by: RT ]

[Grant Betts]

everyear on the rogue when I go fishing with my dad I see people yanking and cranking there rod images/icons/mad.gif...need to start bringing a cell phone.

[Deleted User]

And camcorders and buddies to help educate.

[ 09-11-2001: Message edited by: RT ]

[redbeard]

Twenty plus years ago i qiut fishing up at bonniville because i saw over sized fish being taken out at tanner creek at dawn. I am trying to get back into fishing after all this time but with the talk of snaging i just do not know.It's disturbing images/icons/mad.gif

[MetalHead]

Guys if you want to help solve this problem get involved. Washington has a program called "Eyes in the Woods". I attended one of thier training seminars and they had an officer from WDFW come in and discuss non-violent non-confrontational ways to gather evidence of a violation to turn over to an enforcement officer for investigation. As our society changes I for one would not want to do the confrontation thing especially with visible weapons. The thing about a weapon is it does absolutly no good unless you are willing to use it and if you do you better have a very good reason or you will be somebodies girl friend up in Walla Walla or in an Oregon Correctional Facility depending on where you have your lapse in judgement. Just my .02 cents

[Nanook]

I still say if all else fails on a repeat offender, you see all the time, kick their *** . images/icons/grin.gif