Legalism in the Church

[halfounce]

I was raised in a small Baptist church on the Oregon coast. The woman couldn't where pants, you couldn't dance, if you were a guest and we were having communion you couldn't join in and the list continues. It seemed like every Sunday was Hell Fire and damnation and I must of asked Christ into my heart a 100 times. So my question is what affect's have stuck with you from being raised in a legalistic Church?

halfounce

[Grantspastor]

The most serious impact that comes from a legalistic mentality is that by works we can somehow make ourselves right with God. In Galatians Paul wrote to a group who had received the Gospel, but then also allowed legalistic jews who followed Paul trying to "correct" his teachings to draw them into legalism. Paul wort and said "you were running a good race. Who pushed you off the track? You have fallen from grace.

Pretty serious!

[SKP]

Legalism is tying something extra to the free gift of salvation, such as you must believe and........(fill in the blank with some good work). For example, if women wear pants, you won't get to heaven, or whatever.

The Bible says in Ephesians 2:8-9 KJV, For by grace are ye saved through faith and that not of yourselves. It is the gift of God, not of works, lest any man should boast.

The book of Romans talks of doing good works, AFTER you are saved. For example, my church, the Willamette Valley Baptist Church in Keizer practices door to door evangelism (we call it soul-winning). Does this work get us to heaven? Nope. We do this because we love the Lord, not to gain any points for salvation. This is just simply practicing the great commission at the end of Matthew. Hell is hot, and we have a compassion to keep as many as we can from going there. We'll do our best to tell as many as possible.

When you asked Jesus into your heart to save you and forgive you of your sins, if you meant it, you are on your way to heaven. If you didn't mean it, but just said it to get someone off our back, then you need to trust Jesus. Read Romans 10:9-13, John 3:16, and many others. We still carry around the human nature with our flesh, so sure, we all sin since we get saved, but we just need to talk with God and ask forgiveness. However, this does not give us a license to keep sinning. God chastizes His own people.

But just because we sin after salvation, doesn't mean you loose it. Then salvation would be a non-eternal loan. However, salvation is an eternal gift. The Bible tells us that nothing can seperate us from the love of God.

Our pastor preaches modesty on men and women. Think about it, if you have a beautiful woman in front of you wearing tight jeans, and a beautiful women also in front of you wearing a modest dress, which one are you going to possibily look at and lust? There are modest and immodest pants. There are modest and immodest dresses. The key is not pants, but modesty. I've chosen to go to a church where modesty is preached and practiced. The modesty issue is certainly not tied to salvation, making it legalistic.

Some people confuse legalism with stronger moral standards, but it's not. Stronger moral standards and conducts of living move you farther away from the line of sin. I don't see anything wrong with that. Some people at the Grand Canyon choose to get closer to the edge. The closer you get, the more chance you have to fall. I choose to stay away from the line, or gray area. I've made wrong choices in my life when I've gone too close to some lines, and just didn't have the strength or will power not to cross over into the gray or even black area. Everyone has stumbling blocks. I know what mine are, so I have to keep far away from those.

I went to one of those hell fire and damnation churches when young, what some might call legalistic. Thankfully, I still go to one, but we do not tie anything to salvation other than what the Bible teaches. Hell is hot, and I believe with all my heart that people that don't get saved will burn eternally. This is why I've chosen to go to a church where the main thing is the main thing, telling others about Jesus, and discipling them after salvation, so they can grow in grace, and live by faith.

I hope this is helpful.

SKP

[LIMIT LANDER]

First of all lets define what Legalism is...I believe it is the tendency to reduce Christianity to a set of rules rather than a personal relationship with Christ. this then ends up being a system that judges a pesons relationship with Christ in terms of obeying man made rules. Legalism is vey judemental. It also eliminates the need for true bible decision making. It also produces morally weak people who live with unbiblical sence of guilt. It also takes Gods loving laws and they end up being reduced to petty rules such as, "its wrong for a man to wear hair over his ears", the Christian faith is then cheapened. I feel many Pastors make the mistake of focusing on external through their attack on visiable expressions because they preach against smoking, drinking, cursing, dancing, going to movies and certian clothing etc. "worldliness" when they ignore issuses of the heart such as covetousmess, hatred, strife, idolatry, love of self etc. Remember religious rules never did make anyone more spiritual.

[PIR8 Hook]

Just curious............was that church in Cloverdale, OR???

[SKP]

Here is an online dictionary quote for legalism:

"Christianity belief in necessity of good deeds: the belief that good deeds are required for entrance into Heaven".

Basically, this means "Belief + Rules = Salvation". Legalism is not Biblical teaching.

When a pastor preaches standards and convictions, he fills up the "plate" with "milk" and "meat". It's up to us to decide what we want to eat off that sermon "plate". I don't think a pastor should omit anything Bibilical from his preaching to soothe some. It depends upon our walk with God, whether we eat milk or meat. A new Christian isn't going to change overnight to a perfect mature Christian. It takes time, effort, preaching, study, etc...

There are milk churches and meat churches.

If I were in a building on fire, I would not want someone to timidly say the building is on fire, I might not hear it. I would want someone to yell it at the top of their lungs, so I would have some chance of getting saved.

Preachers need get up and make a stand against those snares that the devil would like us all to fall to. I wouldn't go to a church where there were not warnings for people to stay away from. I would rather go somewhere where standards and convictions are stronger than mine, rather than weaker than mine. This way, I put up a protection so I don't backslide (although we all backslide at times), and gives me goals to shoot for in my Christian growth. I'm not talking extremes and impossibilites though.

SKP

[ 08-12-2003, 01:08 PM: Message edited by: SKP ]

[Screaminreelron]

Legalism is man polluting a relationship with Jesus with "stuff". Just remember HE and your friendship is more important than dancing, drinking, and all the other stuff man throws at us to get us off coarse. Make Jesus your friend and all that won't matter. :smile:

[BuckisMunz]

I've run into ALOT of non-believers who all have the same reason to not become a christian. They all think that churches are going to condemn them for they're actions, and blah blah blah. Trust me, I was one of them one time. But this excuse is lame. I'm sorry, but for someone to say they don't believe in God, because of a church is lame. Christianity isn't based upon a church, or denomination. IT's a personnal thing. So cut trying to find excuses as to not go to church, and find Jesus for yourself. There's also ALOT of churches out there, some will suit you better than others, some will be more liberal, some will be conservative. There's a place for Everyone. But don't let legalizm be a stopping point for a decision that will effect eternity.

[halfounce]

Thanks for all the reply's. My wife, two Boy's and myself do go to church. I was only wondering if anyone else went through that kind of upbringing? It was not fun and I will never attend a church like that again.

I have a 16' drift boat if someone want's to teach me some stretches of water. What I mean is I'm not a master oarsmen. halfounce!!

[feisty's wife]

Turn or burn...you all have forgotten that you have been here, many times before.I used to buy into the Christianeze...but, thankfully, no more.

[ReelTrouble]

I recently did a devotoion on grace and it caused me to realize that being legalistic, and thinking that works get you somewhere is not only unessisary, but its acctually dishonoring to Christ. He gave his life to cover my sins with perfect grace, and when I seek works to "earn my way to heaven" it is almost like I am saying that the sacrifice wasnt enough. The truth is, Christs sacrifice was more than enough, and we need to be confident in his perfect grace to sustain us in our lives of sin.