Hooks for Steelhead

[Wog]

Over the years I have tried many different brands of hooks for Steelhead fishing. Some were good and some would never take an edge.
For the past five or six years I have been using Bronze Eagle Claw Laser sharps in hook sizes ranging from 1 to 3/0. These hooks have worked great for me. Recently the quality of the hooks I have been getting are below par.
This has inspired me to try some different hooks. I went out and bought some Gamakatsu hooks last night. I have used them in the past and I liked them, but when I got home I got to thinking.....
Since I haven't tried any of the new hooks out on the market for years, it would be great to here from anyone willing to share there hook experiences here on the board.
Any comments or suggestions would be appreciated. http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

[Pilar]

Hey Wog. I hardly consider myself an expert but I have a preference here. Red #1 Gamakatsu Octopus. You get 8 in a pack. Combine that w/ some invisible leader 8# or 10# Maxima crystal ivory and a pea size bit of pink yarn in the snelled knot and you're in. I firmly believe that less is better when you're looking for steelies.

Just hook, leader and pink fuzz has consistently caught fish for me when every one else was busted. Seems to me that people always overdo it with steelies. They have good vision and they will see the above mentioned understated presentation. If you have to, add a 4 or 5 egg size bit of coho or steelhead eggs for a topper in slightly colored water.

The only down side of the Gammies is that they are real hard and don't sharpen. If you dull one on a rock, turf it and get a fresh leader out. At $0.25 each you can afford it. Better that then a broken heart when you miss your fish on a dull hook.

The bend is your friend!

[Centerpin]

WOG,

I have been using the eagle claw bronze also. I recently recieved a package from down south containing numerous Vision hooks. They appear to be a cross between gamies and the claw. They are slightly offset and have a nice profile. They do not have the heavy shoulders on the hook point like gamies so you don't get the on and gone syndrome happening. I used Vision over the weekend and landed 75% of my fish in adverse conditions. These are hooks with a pinched barb that slide out easily when you go to unhook them from the mouth. They appear to be priced slightly above the claw but way less than gammies. I am a convert. I haven't sharpened them much yet so the jury is still out on that aspect. I will keep you posted.



[This message has been edited by Centerpin (edited 12-11-2000).]

[Salmonator]

Although I use gammies 90% of the time, A very good replacement when you know you're gonna lose a lotta hooks is a size one VMC in red. Have done well on those and they sharpen up great... Sal

[dawhunt]

Gamakatsuuuu's are the best,I've tried owner hooks they are deadly sharp but the point breaks off then your done and there way spendy.I've got some vision hooks but they look like there twice the thickness of gammies so I never gave them a try.I don't mind changeing leaders once in awhile cus I know and have a lot of confidence in the sharpness and durability of gammies.More then anything I WANT RAIN LOTS OF RAIN NOT SNOW,my river (washougal) is so low and clear you can see every rock and walk across it in most places.Please let it Rain !!! 4 or 5 days would be great.PLEASE !!!! http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif If it doesn't rain soon the steelhead are going to have to walk to get to there spawing grounds.

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Bob Dawson

[meyersbilly]

Here's my two-bits. I use several different brands of hooks for various species and fishing methods.

Float fishing and bottom bouncing I prefer claws, because they are disposable and have a fine point that is easily sharpened. The offset is nice and I like their holding strength.

Bar fishing I prefer gammies, because they don't straighten out and I can really yard on them with full confidence in them holding.

Mooching I prefer VMC because they are a light hook and they have great penetration. I feel they are the finest live bait hook on the market.

Spoons I prefer gammies for point two as above. I can really yard on them and the point seems to last a little longer when tapping rocks.

Flies: Tiemco for personally tied flies and mustad for commercial sale.

I'd sure like to try something new if you guys knew anything better.

[scooby]

For the money the vision hooks are pretty good, but when I tried them the only problem I found was that some of the hooks in the pack were bad. Maybe they have this problem fixed, but I like gammys all the way around. strong and sharp.

I know a guide down south who use the vmc's and swears by them. He told me that you loose less fish with these. I think hooks are like line - alot of them work well and everyone has a preference.

scooby

[dummy]

i used visions for a year they seemed just fine till on day on the satsop i was get fish every cast but couldnt land them then a guy asked if he could fish with me and i said yes he was using the same set up and the same size hook. he started nailing them and landing them. we could figure out why i couldnt hold them it was my hook he was using gamis and they stuck. so i swicthed with great results. but then i went looking again and when to the bait store on the way to the barrier and asked him what hook he uses and he showed me a size six with a staight eye and a weird bend. just bend the eye up and your in business. so for 1.25 for 25 i gave them a try wamo i am in love. the wide gap holds well they are sticky sharp and grab any thing . and the inward ben of the tip prevents accidental snagging. at five cents a peice and better than gami i am in love.

[Wog]

Centerpin,
Sounds like those vision hooks are working well for you. I really hate to change from what has worked well for me in the past, but the quality of the Eagle Claw hooks I have been buying lately are poor. I typically buy my hooks in bulk, and tie up a bunch of rigs in advance. I have found that several of the hook shafts have been deformed and the hook points have been so rounded over they won't even keep an edge. This has been happening to me since last spring.
Thanks for your input. I would be interested to here how those vision hooks hold up throughout the season. http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[Timber Man]

Been a Gammy man for a long time but I tried some of the new Owner hooks with the cutting edge and they are unbelievably sharp.I know they are spendy but I think they might be worth it.I havent fished many so I'm not sold on them completely yet.TM

------------------
You think old growth
looks good,You should
smell the sawdust as
I'm falling one!!!!!

[THE REEL HEY_YALL]

Hey ya Dummy,

I think that hook you are describing is a wide gap hook usually used for soft plastics jigging, like a plastic craw. That weird bend is to rig it to make the lure weedless. See I have a plethera of knowledge. http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif Whether it's good or bad knowledge, IT DOESN'T MATTER. Yeah that hook is used in bassin'

[dummy]

hey yal i might be a bass hook but it slides in with 4lb and holds with 15lb. like i said i think i am in love.

[drifter]

My catch ratio improved 50% after switching from Gamo to Mustad Pro Select (now Ultra Point). I am totally sold on this hook. Just as sharp as Gamo but you can sharpen again after some use. Gamo is impossible to sharpen a second time. Good fishing. drifter.

[Shannon]

Gamakatsu and Mustads

I love to fish tricky water. So I target areas alot of people steer away from, pocket water. I use the Mustads when I approach new water until I figure out where the dead spot is. And that is usually after losing quit a bit of lead as well as hooks. I will never use Eagle Claws again. I fish 15 pound test in them boulders and put the heat on the fish to let him know who's running the show. Lost a nice 13- pounder on Eagle Creek off the Clack because the hook straightened out. Never again!!!

Gammies or Mustad

Shannon

[STRIKE ZONE]

Gami/Gami/Gami.Maxima ug/Maxima ug.
Good luck, STRIKE ZONE

[Centerpin]

BTW

O.Mykiss is the guy who sent me the Oregon care package full of Vision hooks. I will use them for the whole year and keep you updated on the results. One thing I like is the round point. Nature created sharp round objects such as the porcupine quill for one reason only. Penetration.

CP

[THE REEL HEY_YALL]

Be a man and fish OWNER hooks. I just discovered them out here about 2 months ago and I am greatly pleased, haven't lost one yet on an OWNER. It's only Expensive if you start losing gear, get good gear and this won't happen 7 times out of 10. If the point breaks off, big deal, tie on a new leader...may take about 1 minute. I have fished and still regularly fish with Gammies, but I have lost fish and fish and fish on them and they suck as far as sharpening goes unless you have a battery powered sharpener like I have. Vision is alright....and the way you said Penetration scares me Centerpin http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

[STRIKE ZONE]

Hey 'Yall, If your not losin riggins your not fishin. Good luck, STRIKE ZONE

[Jim]

Vision... http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif

Jim

[Vic Carrao]

Hey Jay, I wonder who O my kiss is? back when Vison first came out, Lorne the owner sent me a few packs of them ranging from #4 to 6/0. My job was to test them out and report back with a field report.

There are two styles that I know of, regular point and the ones that are a copy of eagle claws, not sure of the exact model names.
They sent me the regular packs, so that is all I tested to start with.

Before even using them I had one beef, in every pack I found hooks that were dull which is a result of poor quality control. The larger the hook the more dull hooks per pack. Strike two! As you know, the larger the hook the less you get in a pack so having 3 of 8 hooks dull right out of the pack hardly makes them cheaper.The second problem was trying to sharpen them, If you have a good stone it only takes a few strokes, but if you took more than a few swipes the hook point would be reduced to the point of, well no point.

The first hooks I tested were #1 & 2's, bottom bouncing the Fraser for sockeye. It didn't take me more than a few hours before I came to the conclusion that cheap hooks are exactly that, cheap! They would lose there point in only a few drifts. Well you could imagin the reaction from the owner when I gave him my report, he freeked. He said I didn't know what I was talking about and wanted to send his top sales man and guide from Washington to fish with me on a paid trip. You see i was not only doing a field report for Vision but was also reporting back to a few major tackle stores in the area who Vison wanted to carry the product.

I forget his name right now (maybe Bill) but a nice guy from Washington came up a few days later to fish with me. It was a great day, the Fraser was closed to retention so we had the river to ourselves.(Lets call him Bill just for the heck of it). Bill brought a large plano box full of hooks ranging from #6 to 7/0 with both styles, there must have been well over a thousand hooks. We began to hook fish after fish only a few minutes into the day. Bill quickly agreed with me when after two drifts his landing percentage went to hell. Bill also found that quality control was a issue that must be addressed.
After agreeing that Vison hooks were a poor choice for bottom bouncing we began using the higher quality Vison hook that is priced
somewhere between Eagle claw and Gammies. These hooks are much better and passed the test of bottom bouncing with flying colors.
Bill left me with the box as a gift so I have used atleast 6 or 700 of them. I won't use them for bottom bouncing but they seem to be fine for float fishing or plunking. The larger hooks made for Sturgeon are still poor in quality control and dullen fast.

Final report: For the average angler I think they are a good buy for the money. Don;t use them for bottom bouncing, go to the higher priced model or just use gammies. Float fishing with regular Visons is just fine but check you hooks to make sure there sharp out of the package. For plunking or sturgeon, why take a chance, spend a few extra cents and buy the best, after all you time has to be worth something.

[Centerpin]

Vic,

I noticed that there were two different types of hooks. Ones that wouldnt peirce your skin and ones that were deadly sharp. I ignored the blunt ones and stuck with the sharp ones. I have yet to find a bad one in the bunch. I believe O. Mykiss posts on this board. Maybe search for his posts withing this site. I will keep you posted on my upcoming Visions.

I think you already know that I won't touch a gammie for steelheading. I use them (gammies) exclusively in siwash for spoons and the larger sizes from 7/0-9/0 for chinook

[Salmonator]

CP, just curious as to why you wouldn't touch a gammie for steelhead. I have fished vision hooks and wouldn't touch one again if they were free. They are the only hooks i've ever broken (4/0 with 30lb mono) and the steelhead size are too heavy of a wire to drift fish with. But that's just my opinion. On the other hand I use vision swivels exclusively for the last two or three years, IMHO they have the best swivels available short of a bearing sampo.... Joe

[Centerpin]

Gammies are sharp but they have two drawbacks IMHO. The first is the fact that they are not offset. I find that offset hooks stick the fish better. The second is the heavy shoulder they have upstream of the point. If you don't hit a fish hard you get a few head shakes and he is gone. I have used bronze claws for the last 3 years so things may have changed. I don't know the model of Vison hooks I have. I just grabbed the pack out of the box tied up some 2/0 and have fished with them since. I am 18 for 23 so far. The rod might have something to do with it. I use a powerhouse loomis that really puts the steel into them. That and the big windup two step hookset http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/mad.gif

YOU GUYS HAVE ME SPOOKED NOW.

I am now going through all my packages in the various sizes http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/blush.gif

[Grant Scheele]

Centerpin, what you will find when you go through your packages is this: The smaller the hook, the better the sharpness and the quality control. The small #2's are just deadly sharp and virtually all of the package will be sharp. The company making these hooks have not yet perfected the larger hooks(larger wire) on a consistant basis. Once you get to a 3/0 and larger about 25% of the hooks are not sticky sharp. Some are down right dull. The companay claims to be working on the problem as we speak. I have yet to hear of a small hook breaking.

For normal winter Steelhead fishing you will probably love the #1's through the 2/0. For low water conditions when using a small corkie, I have heard complaints about the weight of the #4 hooks causing lots of snags and break offs. I have found this to be a problem myself. I also go to a small wire hook in Summer conditions. Just makes sense.

The swivels are cheap and fabulous and I have never heard a complaint but I am waiting anyday for Salmonator to complain because he is a whiner. http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Vic, Lorne is no longer the owner of Vision hooks. Joe Superfisky is the controlling owner but he has partners. Lorne works for Vision but is a little to senile to run a business any more. And yes, he is very sensitive about the quality of his hooks. I questioned him once about the quality of the 5/0's and he called me an "arrogant jerk". That hurt my feelings so I tried to stick him with one of his hooks but I couldn't penatrate his old hide. http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Grant

[meyersbilly]

Does anyone fish Daichi anymore? I had a fella from the great lakes send me a couple boxes and they were a fine bait and small gear hook. Plenty sharp, good penetration and not bad strength. Easterners swear by them.

CP: Ask Vic about sturgeon skutes (sp?). I think they may be diamond shaped and I know they are sharper than heck and have great penetration. Not knocking the porki pi (french) theory though.

Is a diamond cut sharper than a round point? I don't know, but when I sharpen my hooks they usually end up this way.

[Centerpin]

Does anyone know what shape a bee stinger is? Billy I remember those daichi hooks. They worked pretty good behind a jensen egg too http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

How much of the overall landing percentage is in the rod (hookset)?

[smilesforu]

Rod hook set is a direct reflection of how tight the line is to the lure. You can have the best hookset in the world, but if you have lots of slack you can't get it done. I use Mustad 3/0 9263E (discontinued) and hand file them. I fall asleep on the rod alot but because of sharp hooks and a tight line I eventually let them know I am still there. I had some sample vision hooks sent to me and wasn't impressed with the quality...in fact superfly got mad when I mentioned the poor quality of his hooks. But my hooks were of the larger size so perhaps in the smaller size the hooks are great. If you stumble across some of the 9263E in 3/0 I would pay in american money for them http://www.ifish.net/forum/images/graemlins/grin.gif
Tight Lines

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Marty M
Steelheader.net (http://www.steelheader.net/)

[Deleted User]

IMHO, any of the better hooks available today (Owners, Gami's, Mustads, E.C. Laser Sharps, Visions in the smaller 2, 1, & 1/0, etc.) that are the right style for steelhead will be very good hooks. The more important issue to me is developing the skill to obtain and keep a super sticky sharp and properly tapered hook point at all times! And I haven't found any modern hooks that are better than my old favorite Mustad 92553 hooks; discontinued, but I still have lots of them. - RT

[THE REEL HEY_YALL]

Meyersbilly,

I have totally forgotten about Diachii hooks. **slap** Those hooks are super great and if I had nothing but a quality store near me, I would buy nothing but Owner and Diachii hooks. Being from the Southeast, I fished Diachii's primarily on the Gulf. Setting the hook, I have killed several saltwater species by burying the hook in the brain. They are pretty expensive, and they are very tough. I have only bought one pack of them out here, and I can only find them at one place. I was very pleased with that pack, but still "iffy" if they are as good as their bigger saltwater hooks.

[Hoosier Daddy]

Meyersbilly: since you asked, its "scutes" with a C.